Bishop Tutu, on the Importance of Stopping Anti-Gay Hatred

[wlotus]

That this pandering to intolerance is being done by politicians looking for scapegoats for their failures is not surprising. But it is a great wrong. An even larger offense is that it is being done in the name of God. Show me where Christ said "Love thy fellow man, except for the gay ones." Gay people, too, are made in my God's image. I would never worship a homophobic God.

Read the rest of Bishop Tutu's op-ed piece in the Washington Post...

Comments

[arkadelos.livejournal.com]

In one country, might be Nigeria, homosexuality is punishable by death. I don't know if they're tortured beforehand like in the Middle East. I just can't imagine a government encouraging that level of violence.

[musesing.livejournal.com]

That is encouraging. I knew that Bishop Tutu was generally on the side of the marginalized but didn't know his position on homosexuals specifically. I am glad that he is speaking out.

[verucas-chaos.livejournal.com]

Impressive indeed. Thank you for posting this...I'm going to post it too.

[ruthiebgr8.livejournal.com]

"... And does any of us know the mind of God so well that we can decide for him who is included, and who is excluded, from the circle of his love?"

Wowsers!! LOVE that quote. Too often "christians" believe they are the mouthpiece of God, they forget that there's 2 *mouths* to a body and they may be the stinky one rather than the one that speaks God's truth.

I am becoming less and less tolerant of my intolerant "christian" brothers and sisters. I try to remember that they are loved by God as well, but sometimes it's difficult when they so clearly reject God's love for *their* brothers and sisters.

[wlotus.livejournal.com]

"...they may be the stinky one..." LOL! That thought is enough to make one pause and TRULY consider themselves!

[arkadelos.livejournal.com]

I don't know what your experiences have been, but the vast majority of the Christians I know are accepting and tolerant of homosexuals because they do believe in "Love Thy Neighbor" and in treating others the way they want to be treated. The most obvious proof is that homosexuals here are much better off than in Africa. Here, they don't have to closet themselves out of fear of imprisonment or death. I am glad Desmond Tutu is speaking out over what's going on in Africa.

[wlotus.livejournal.com]

For the most part, LGBT people are better off here, though it depends on where they are. There are pockets of intolerance so violent here that they would be dragged out and beaten or killed, and the local authorities would turn a blind eye. Even in places where the local authorities would not turn a blind eye, those attacks happen; we recently had a few such attacks here in NYC, a pretty liberal city, overall. Those attacks happened in neighborhoods where the majority culture (black, west indian, or hispanic) tends to be violently homophobic.

The federal government may not carry out that kind of violence, but they are complicit in it by practicing separate-but-equal excuses like "Don't Ask, Don't Tell" and their silence on marriage equality (silence outside of some federal lawmakers trying to work discriminatory marriage language into the country's constitution, that is). That is the trouble with the federal government not decisively ruling that LGBT people deserve all of the same rights and privileges as heterosexuals, such as marriage and the ability to openly serve in the military. That is a subtle but powerful message the federal government sends to individuals, who then feel even more justified in practicing bigotry and violence. If the federal government thinks different rules need to apply to one minority group, local governments can choose to be as discriminatory as they desire, and individuals feel more empowered to practice hatred and violence.

"Better off" doesn't equal "as well off as they deserve to be, including fully equal to heterosexuals".

[arkadelos.livejournal.com]

"Better off" doesn't equal "as well off as they deserve to be, including fully equal to heterosexuals".

Very true, and I believe they deserve full equality. My main comment was how Christians over here are by-and-large accepting and tolerant.

There are pockets of intolerance and bigotry everywhere. It all boils down to: is this the family, the community, or the nation? and that question has to be answered on a case-by-case basis.

I am involved in women's rights. I know how badly women can be and have been marginalized over here, so I want to improve the way women are treated. Nonetheless, I appreciate this country for its opportunities. This country does not deserve the same level of hatred than that of Iran or Nigeria. The condition of women in USA is just not comparable to the condition of women in Iran. There differences between the two are so extreme. Same with homosexuals.

It is one thing to say "Appreciate what you have but don't ask for anything more" and an entirely different thing to say "Appreciate what you have and keep striving for more and better things" To me, it is all a matter of self-esteem.

I do believe in full equality, but not every country should be painted with the same brush.

[wlotus.livejournal.com]

It is insensitive to tell a marginalized group, particularly one to whom you do not belong, that they should not be so angry and paint their circumstances in so harsh a light. That is my point. Saying things are not as bad as somewhere else is a form of dismissing their feelings.

We've had this discussion before, and I am distressed that you don't seem to get it, yet.

[arkadelos.livejournal.com]

You have every right to be upset at inequalities. I never said you shouldn't be upset. I also belong to a marginalized group, so I know what it feels like and I speak from experience; that is why I talked about women. I believed it would be a strong and proper analogy. I wish we could have this conversation equally both as members of marginalized groups.

You said "For the most part, LGBT people are better off here, though it depends on where they are."
That statement makes me wonder why we are having another argument and how this is dismissive of feelings.

And you also said, "Better off" doesn't equal "as well off as they deserve to be, including fully equal to heterosexuals". to which I replied, "Very true, and I believe they deserve full equality."

[wlotus.livejournal.com]

The most obvious proof is that homosexuals here are much better off than in Africa.

I find this statement offensive the same way I would find the following statement offensive.

"Her husband stopped beating her; now he only yells at her and calls her names from time to time. She's better off now than before, so why is she asking for more?"

Please do not express that sentiment again in my blog.